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dudes, I was merely stating the difference between a kernel/bios and a GUI/GUE. It was not to flame at Flyguy's bios, not at all! gees, whaz up with ya lot. anyway. the question remains: Will be be using this piece?? (and all it's overhead) l8er

after a lot of decoding... your writing.... (i also got a bad ENGLISH writing)..

if the question is "Will be using this piece?" ... i interpret that as "if I are using that code..." the answer is . YES... but in other programming platform.

if i was wrong ... please tellme...

No, it was a global question. like "Hey all you msx freaks, are you planning to use the mnbios?" I think it's cool, or atleast for your (fly) programming experience, to come up with such a devious plan. But is there a market wide enough for this plan. Are other ppl interrested in coding for it for the future anyway. (and NO, probably I will not for obvious reasons)

hope this helps

I think we had established before that MNBIOS is probably not the right choice for advanced MSX coders like Ro, GuyveR, Michiel de Vries and many others that have shown they can squeeze the max out of an MSX. However, especially with a powerful BASIC application, or a WILD compatible webbrowser... it could become very interesting for the 'less advanced MSXer'. Like me .

Don't forget MNBIOS is a multitasking environment, its simply a lot different than stand-alone coding!
I hear people saying they'd like their MSX to run more applications at once, and MNBIOS can provide that. So can UZIX, but the difference is MNBIOS is programmed in assembly, UZIX in C.

There's no point in reinventing the wheel all the time...

(and btw, I didn't see any flames nor was anything I wrote meant as such)

The history say than will be happen...

Remember when all programmers on PC ... made code for MSDOS 6.x...

And then appear WIN 3.x ..... what happening in that time? (ofcourse, on the PC platform the hardware ppl develop the 386 and 486)... on msx is an attempt to do that ..


first come the offices aplications... all gamers ppl say...no, i don't want to coding for that... is not enought speed...


Then come DIRECTX or OpenGL and the ppl feel better developing under that standard because no need re-inventing the wheel... and why that was possible? because you got a OS core supporting libraries......maybe on mnbios can be some games drivers library...who knows? is too early now... the time will say the last word

Now about new develops MSDOS (that ugly OS) no exist more....

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... it could become very interesting for the 'less advanced MSXer'. Like me .

So how do a less advanced user get the compiled program back onto a disk that works with nmbios?

• Load it onto a normat msx disk
  
• run the disk convert program, for nmbios?
  

?

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it could become very interesting for the 'less advanced MSXer'. Like me .

I don't get why you underestimate yourself here? So you aren't much of an MSX coder? But you can make pretty nice tunes on MSX.

Hmm, might be a nice application running in MNBIOS... A music program. Either MML or a tracker I will leave up to the developers.

But, why multitasking?
I can understand it for the Turbo-R, but not for 3,5 MHz computers. You divide that speed and even worse, some CPU time is used to switch process and manage all this. I think that MSX is not the best system for multitasking. It is better to have only one thread and push it to its maximum.

pitpan....the mnbios change the active aplication only when de user desides that... pressing GRPH + CODE + CTRL, you can test it on DEMO version but the multitasking window looks ugly. Because that no lose speed.

The back-ground proccess for maintain alive an aplication like some players is other thing...that is foresee for the future "take a look to the <BTASK> entrance on the EXEC header"....now is obligatory to point that to a RET instruction for future compatibility...

The idea is than in a future version a program will able to enable with a kernel function the BTASK service and use it...there is two way to choice...

1 Maybe to do the BTASK aplication routine be executed on interrupt routine. That will got several limitations for the code or functions that can be executed inside BTASK like avoid to execute drivers functions or any function... then only rest for execute aplications data management....

OR

2 Fast service management for background proccess... that = execute the background only when any kernel or driver function are NOT executed.... that is possible simply testing the PC pointer and ABS PAGE.... in that fast way execute the Backgrounds proccess but with a few limitation as avoid change or execute then memory residence indexs functions....like RCALL or RJP ... using instead LCALL or LJP, sure, that complicate a bit the programming of BTASK, but that surelly will be used only by advanced programmers. ( check the english manual at 114-116 pages).

I like the way 2...

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But, why multitasking?

You seem to want to stop progress wherever possible. MSX users are asking for multitasking!

MSX users want to run a text-editor and play music at the same time, they want to run an assembler environment and a graphic tool at the same time, etc... Some possibilities already exist with the use of TSR's, but TSR's are specially designed programs.

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Quote: ... it could become very interesting for the 'less advanced MSXer'. Like me . So how do a less advanced user get the compiled program back onto a disk that works with nmbios? Load it onto a normat msx disk run the disk convert program, for nmbios? ?

The MNBIOS disk is a normal disk indeed... of any format (like 360k 720k 1.2M 1.44M or any invented format MS compatible) for test it on the demo version... first run the MNBIOS then on the openMSX emulator change the DISK A mounted without do a reset... i not know how do that....then you can do a DIR

Actually for outside argentine users, or the 720K format users, can't use the DSK image of MNBIOS DEMO in a normal emulated MSX because you will get "DISK OFFLINE" error. That is because the DISK-ROM from Microchot is able only to use the 720k format and not 360k. For fix that, is necesary to use a management DSK program for extract all files and create a new DSK image with another format and import all the file... then use convertion program MSX4CONV for extend the names to the correct file naming.

The mnbios is able to manage fully all formats well-know and invented formats...every when the format follow the MS rules like do a BOOT + FAT + ROOT DIR. Check the programmer manual for see the charts format...(only spanish version now).

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Quote: But, why multitasking? You seem to want to stop progress wherever possible. MSX users are asking for multitasking! MSX users want to run a text-editor and play music at the same time, they want to run an assembler environment and a graphic tool at the same time, etc... Some possibilities already exist with the use of TSR's, but TSR's are specially designed programs.

MNBIOS is able of all that things without use SPECIAL programming....

Remember exist 2 kind of aplications... one is that normal aplication than need the user interact for do his duty.... that aplication not need back-ground proccess... like NotePad or WordPad or an assembler enviroment...

Other kind of aplications are the players of any kind of string.... actually the MNBIOS got inside a music player, that already got a music string format and a console commands. But if you don't want to use that you can always use the interrupt hooks.

Do simply things like .... a graphic volume meter that need change all the time the active window....if you mount the aplication on one....3.58mhz? i not think so.

Or simply copying files on background.... that mean to use the drivers functions as background proccess... for able of do that is needed DINAMIC LOADING STRUCTURING INSTANCES (crating structure/init/purge/destroying).... on a 128KB normal MSX2 with 3.57mhz... better be reallist... and do a O.S. fast, nice and very usable....

Anyway the MNBIOS got a structures management that is able to share the resources between all aplications... like dinamic high memory (DATAMEMO), FCB (file control block --->the aplication got a INDEX to an FCB and the driver will use it). any aplication memory block (an aplication can create/erase any memory block for use it, by example for buffering). And tools like that.... sure i forgot a lot.....

My goal is FIRST .... SPEED ... then MULTITASKING.... then capability...

Hi

I can not get the demo to work!!
Compile with TNIASM
Convert with MSX4File.bas
Load NMBios + demodisk
Load my disk in drive B:

When I type hello or hello.exec I get error?
Why?

Thanks
JP

IIRC, the current demo version of MNBIOS does not support execution of programs.

Flyguille

When will a version be available that can execute programs?
Anyway the Hello world demo can be seen? (other than in assembly that is)