Quote:

Wait! What's this about having to BUY a cable to program the FPGA? Doesnt the OCM come with the necessary cables to change the vhdl code? If not, than it's even worse! How could ASCII sell it as a "kit to learn FPGA" (an not just an MSX1), if you dont have all the tools to program it?

You don't need a cable to change the VHDL code. You have VHDL sourcecode, you can
change and compile it and after that, you invoke a synthesis tool which is available from ALTERA. This tool generates a bitstream file to be loaded on the FPGA via the cable.

So, you need a download cable to load the bitstream derived from the VHDL sourcecode
by the synthesis to the device. I don't know about the cable used in the OCM, but its possible that this cable is very simple, e.g. just a centronics cable or a serial cable. It depends on the interfaces available on the OCM board.

Quote:

GuyveR800 posted a reply to something that was written in this thread. I think it's appropriate to point you to this link.

You think it's appropriate or Guyver asked you? Reread what you write before you post BiFi I understand you don't want to come out as the handpuppet, so maybe it's a good advise to read before you post?

As Tanni stated: you don't need a cable to change VHDL code, and the cable is probably not very difficult to build for yourself. Besides, if you have more One Chip MSX computers (or share, as [D-Tail] suggested), one cable would be sufficient. If possible, Bazix will try and offer buyers of the One Chip MSX to choose whether they want a cable with it or not, the version with cable being a bit more expensive, of course. Again, as soon as Bazix are ready to announce the One Chip MSX distribution, you'll be the first to know.

why is bazix delaying a lot the announce?

That's really none of your business I can assure you Bazix would love to have started pre-orders weeks ago. Have patience please...

Quote:

GuyveR800 posted a reply to something that was written in this thread. I think it's appropriate to point you to this link.

I don't think it's appropriate since his comment doesn't add anything to this discussion.

I think the OCM should include everything needed to program the fgpa, since that's one of the big reasons it is a interesting device in the first place. I don't think anybody will use it as an MSX1.

Quote:

As Tanni stated: you don't need a cable to change VHDL code, and the cable is probably not very difficult to build for yourself. Besides, if you have more One Chip MSX computers (or share, as [D-Tail] suggested), one cable would be sufficient. If possible, Bazix will try and offer buyers of the One Chip MSX to choose whether they want a cable with it or not, the version with cable being a bit more expensive, of course. Again, as soon as Bazix are ready to announce the One Chip MSX distribution, you'll be the first to know.

If you want to learn VHDL, you will simulate your designs before synthesizing it. If you never had contact to VHDL -- or hardware design with other hardware description languages -- you will probably not be able to just do a view changes to the sourcecode and you'll get an MSX2 in the OCM. So just to learn FPGA, you first don't need the FPGA device. For to get started, the VHDL compiler and simulator first suffice. You should start with small designs, e.g. simple gates like NAND, NOR, XOR. Than you should simulate it. The design flow for hardware design is a little more complicated as just coding software! E.g. you can implement a XOR gate in several ways: by dataflow description, by algorithmic description and by structural description.

For doing more complex designs, today, you can relay on algorithmic description, which looks similar to a ADA or Pascal sourcecode. But you need the other to ways of description, too. VHDL has its syntax form ADA, which is itself a descendant form Pascal.

In VHDL, you can intermix all of that three ways of hardware description freely! You can simulate it. You'll get waveforms from the signals defined in the VHDL source. You can check if the waveforms are that what you expected. If not, you can change the soruce code and simuate it again, until the waveforms are finally right. Of course, this is only adviseable with small designs. But, every complex design consists of small designs, so you can check their correctness separatly. This is MOST advisable! If there're several errors in a very huge design -- e.g. the MSX system would be such a complex design -- you will wast very much time to find all the errors if you look at the design as a whole.

With FPGA device, you need not simulate it, you can just try if you get the results desired. But, if something is not correct ... see above! So don't mind about the VHDL, the download cable, it'll be fine, if you'll finally get it. VHDL is a wonderful design language, the idea to implement MSX in an FPGA using VHDL is wonderful, too. Thanks, Mr. Nishi!

Quote:

[quote]I think the OCM should include everything needed to program the fgpa, since that's one of the big reasons it is a interesting device in the first place. I don't think anybody will use it as an MSX1.

Are you sure that nobody will use it as an MSX1?

If you just want a new MSX and if you're not interested in learning FPGA, than, the OCM is
right for you without modification if you're just interested in MSX1. Maybe you can probably get the MSX2 upgrade on a fair, if you will take the OCM with you. For now, we should be content
with the new MSX1 OCM. Its better than having no new MSX!

I don't know if there's a configuration ROM or (E)EPROM on the OCM, to download the
MSX configuration form that ROM or EPROM. If so, you will just need to get the MSX2 configuration on ROM or EPROM. If this ROM or EPROM is on a socket, than the upgrade to MSX2 would be very simple. In this case, the OCM will be upgradable without getting in contact to VHDL.

Now you guys EAT THIS

I think all you have to be very very very happy all the things mrc and bazix are doing for msx. They spend almost all their free-time on msx and still I see a lot of comment here on the mrc. Shame on you! I don't say there may be no comment over here,but sometimes people go to far. (This is only my opinion)

complainers/war-heros are present in each medium/big community/forum worldwide..

I'm sure mrc has a thick elephant-skin however ^_^

Quote:

complainers/war-heros are present in each medium/big community/forum worldwide.. I'm sure mrc has a thick elephant-skin however ^_^

Wolf you're one of them , Serious now, I know they have a thick skin, but sometimes people haven't got any respect anymore

Quote:

Quote: GuyveR800 posted a reply to something that was written in this thread. I think it's appropriate to point you to this link. You think it's appropriate or Guyver asked you? Reread what you write before you post BiFi I understand you don't want to come out as the handpuppet, so maybe it's a good advise to read before you post?

Ehrm... if GuyveR800 wasn't banned he could react directly, and no... he didn't ask me to post it. If you're trying to get me annoyed to get to your level of communication, you really should either try harder or use a different approach.

Quote:

Quote: Quote: GuyveR800 posted a reply to something that was written in this thread. I think it's appropriate to point you to this link. You think it's appropriate or Guyver asked you? Reread what you write before you post BiFi I understand you don't want to come out as the handpuppet, so maybe it's a good advise to read before you post? Ehrm... if GuyveR800 wasn't banned he could react directly, and no... he didn't ask me to post it. If you're trying to get me annoyed to get to your level of communication, you really should either try harder or use a different approach.

You didn't understand the Bifi?

ps.. I'm not one of them, I protest