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MFR SCC+ SD kernel version

Por Latok

msx guru (3938)

Imagen del Latok

26-01-2023, 19:37

In this forumthread we were discussing why Lilly's Saga, when flashed inside my MFR SCC+ SD, is having issues... I tried some other big-data-games such as Pointless Fighting and Super Mario World and they work just fine!

So, that could indicate that the issue is in the Lilly's Saga game.

BUT......I have a second MFR SCC+ SD and I decided to flash Lilly's Saga into this MFR and guess what? It works like a charm. No problems.

The only difference between the two MFR devices is the kernel version. The MFR with kernel version 1.2 boots Lilly's Saga just fine but the MFR with kernel version 1.3 is giving problems.

When scrolling through the msxcartridgeshop pages I don't see any references to kernel version 1.2 or 1.3. There only is this KERNEL.DAT 1.19

I was chatting to Bengalack about all this and he hadn't heard of the 1.3 kernel version. He only knows the 1.2 version of the MFR...

What's the difference between 1.2 and 1.3 kernels and where can they be downloaded?

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Por Latok

msx guru (3938)

Imagen del Latok

26-01-2023, 22:01

If I may add something. I tried the MFR 1.3 version in an NMS8220 and I got a disk i/o error. Because there is only 64kB in this machine and no mapped RAM, it can't boot from FAT16 partition in DOS2. And since the SD cards I use with this MFR are FAT16 formatted, I guess that's logical.
But the MFR 1.2 version DOES WORK in the NMS8220. And it has also FAT16 formatted SD cards! How is that possible?

Both the MFR cartridges (should) have 512kB RAM on board (that's how I bought them), but I understand from the msxcartridgeshop pages that the computer itself must have mapped RAM to make FAT16+DOS2 work?

/me baffled...

**EDIT** Hmpf, with the MFR 1.3 cartridge, when using MEM.COM to scan for memory mappers, the only mapper it finds is in slot 3. So that gives thought to the idea there is no 512kB RAM inside this MFR. Tomorrow I can test the MFR 1.2 cartridge.

Por Bengalack

Paladin (747)

Imagen del Bengalack

27-01-2023, 08:08

Great findings. I wonder when the v1.3 version was released (my 1.2 was on my MFR when I acquired it in April 2021). I also wonder if there is anyone out there that has Lilly working properly with music with MFR v1.3.

The rom-segment numbers that seem “swapped” or not correctly selected are segments 20-76 (320kB-1216kB). Changing segments in the page happens multiple times per frame.

Por Guillian

Prophet (3517)

Imagen del Guillian

27-01-2023, 12:43

Latok wrote:

So, that could indicate that the issue is in the Lilly's Saga game.

Old MFR SD (before mid 2017) have the ASCII 16 mapper limited to 1 MB. So probably that's the problem.

Latok wrote:

BUT......I have a second MFR SCC+ SD and I decided to flash Lilly's Saga into this MFR and guess what? It works like a charm. No problems.

That MFR SD can handle up to 4 MB in ASCII 16. But checking old emails, you ordered the cartridges in 2015 and 2016. So both should be limited to 1 MB. oO

Latok wrote:

The only difference between the two MFR devices is the kernel version. The MFR with kernel version 1.2 boots Lilly's Saga just fine but the MFR with kernel version 1.3 is giving problems.

Versions 1.2 and 1.3 are related to Nextor SD driver. That is not related to how mappers are managed by the cartridge.

Latok wrote:

When scrolling through the msxcartridgeshop pages I don't see any references to kernel version 1.2 or 1.3. There only is this KERNEL.DAT 1.19

KERNEL.DAT file contains Nextor + ROM Disk. The versión of the file is related to the versión of the ROM Disk/OPFXSD.
All cartridges I produce have 1.2 SD driver version (Nextor Kernel version 2.1.0 Alpha 2).
If you have 1.3 probably you updated Nextor in that cartridge..

Latok wrote:

What's the difference between 1.2 and 1.3 kernels and where can they be downloaded?

Version 1.3 implements DRV_CONFIG routine.
You can install v1.2 using KERNEL.DAT in MSX Cartridge Shop web.
You can install v1.3 from latest Nextor version: https://github.com/Konamiman/Nextor/releases/tag/v2.1.1

Latok wrote:

If I may add something. I tried the MFR 1.3 version in an NMS8220 and I got a disk i/o error. Because there is only 64kB in this machine and no mapped RAM, it can't boot from FAT16 partition in DOS2. And since the SD cards I use with this MFR are FAT16 formatted, I guess that's logical.
But the MFR 1.2 version DOES WORK in the NMS8220. And it has also FAT16 formatted SD cards! How is that possible?

The cartridge that works has 512 kB RAM, so it can use Nextor, FAT16, etc.

Latok wrote:

Both the MFR cartridges (should) have 512kB RAM on board (that's how I bought them), but I understand from the msxcartridgeshop pages that the computer itself must have mapped RAM to make FAT16+DOS2 work?

If the MFR SD has 512 kB, the computer does not need to have at least 128 kB RAM to load Nextor, since the RAM in the cartridge will be used as main memory.

Latok wrote:

**EDIT** Hmpf, with the MFR 1.3 cartridge, when using MEM.COM to scan for memory mappers, the only mapper it finds is in slot 3. So that gives thought to the idea there is no 512kB RAM inside this MFR. Tomorrow I can test the MFR 1.2 cartridge.

That's weird. If you bought it with 512 kB RAM, it should have it.
When you bought your first MFR SD you asked me about why the extra memory was not shown on a cold boot on turbo R. I explained about the BIOS booting faster that the FPGA in the cartridge. You confirmed me that the extra 512 kB RAM was shown after a reset.

Bengalack wrote:

I wonder when the v1.3 version was released (my 1.2 was on my MFR when I acquired it in April 2021). I also wonder if there is anyone out there that has Lilly working properly with music with MFR v1.3.

v1.3 was released in 2018, but it is not related to the problem. It depends on the FPGA configuration.

Bengalack wrote:

The rom-segment numbers that seem “swapped” or not correctly selected are segments 20-76 (320kB-1216kB). Changing segments in the page happens multiple times per frame.

Since the ASCII 16 mapper is limited to 1MB in old MFR SD, banks 0-63 are mirrored in 64-127.

Possible solutions:
- Use mapper ASCII 8 instead of ASCII 16
- Update the FPGA configuration in the MFR SD cartridge (I'll do it for free, excl. shipping)
- Add 128 to the bank number in banks 64-127 (This will work only in old MFR SD)

Por gdx

Enlighted (6213)

Imagen del gdx

27-01-2023, 14:08

Is there a document that describes the characteristics of the different versions? MFRs are supposed to be simple but it has become obscure over time.

Por sdsnatcher73

Prophet (3954)

Imagen del sdsnatcher73

27-01-2023, 14:15

My MFR does run Lilly just fine. It is also running Nextor 2.12 (and as such driver 1.3. But Lilly wil run before Nextor starts so it is indeed unrelated.

Por Latok

msx guru (3938)

Imagen del Latok

27-01-2023, 14:32

I just tested my MFR 1.2 and mem.com gives 512kb ram inside this one. I also flashed lilly's saga using ascii16 and played for almost an hour. No issues! Although I understand now it shouldnt work because this MFR should be limited to 1024kb ram data...

Odd things. And I have more, with all this testing I also found out some SD cards do work on the one MFR but don't on the other! How weird is that!!

Anyhow, Guillian, thank you for your extensive reply, maybe I should send both cartridges to you for maintenance. I already wanted to update them anyway so they run badapple at correct speed and with correct audio...

Por Guillian

Prophet (3517)

Imagen del Guillian

27-01-2023, 17:22

Latok, please, send me both cartridge and I'll have a look and them. Also I'll update the FPGA with the latest configuration that can play Bad Apple demo.
This version also allows to update the FPGA using OPFXSD. So if a new version is released, you will not need to send me the cartridges again.