New game for MSX1 (Transball)

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By santiontanon

Paragon (1737)

santiontanon's picture

27-06-2016, 16:25

Yeah, scroll is the part I'm most unhappy about the game. Specially since internally the game does compute all the positions of bullets, ship, ball, etc. at a resolution of 1/16th of a pixel, but then when rendering, I need to translate those to blocks of 8 pixels, which looks blocky and it's sometimes hard to gauge the current speed of the ship. But oh well, once you get used to it, it's not that bad Smile

By Buleste

Master (158)

Buleste's picture

27-06-2016, 17:53

Any chance of a .WAV or .CAS version?

By Metalion

Paragon (1617)

Metalion's picture

27-06-2016, 17:54

santiontanon wrote:

About Hit9918 smooth scroll. I tried to check it out but the link at does not work for me! Does anyone have an updated link? I think it'll be hard to incorporate since it uses a lot of memory, but it could be an interesting challenge Smile

AFAIK, any smooth scrolling engine on MSX1 is based on multiple tilesets storing each a little pixel variation from the others, and using the hybrid mode of the VDP in order to be able to use only one bank of tiles on the whole screen. Within the limits of the existing RAM and VRAM, of course.

And there lies the problem. Because if you use a complex background, you increase (sometimes too much) the tileset size needed to perform the scroll. And if you use multi-directional scrolling (as in this game), then the size needed increases even more. Of course, you often find optimizations, and you can reduce size a little bit, but it is often out of reach.

A real example on a game I am developing : the static tileset is 34 tiles. If I want to implement a 4px horizontal and 4px vertical scrolling (that's not even a fine scrolling, it's just half-fine), I need 2 tilesets : one of 211 tiles, one of 319 tiles (optimizations made). Roughly, even if we can all agree it's not linear, it means you need 16 times more tiles than your original tileset, just to make a 4px multidirectional scrolling.

Not really worth it ...

By dioniso

Champion (479)

dioniso's picture

27-06-2016, 18:43

Congratulations. Really nice game.

By nitrofurano

Champion (301)

nitrofurano's picture

27-06-2016, 19:31

really good game! consider porting it to ColecoVision and Sega-SG1000 (it’s not that difficult!!! Smile )

By nitrofurano

Champion (301)

nitrofurano's picture

27-06-2016, 19:34

Buleste wrote:

Any chance of a .WAV or .CAS version?

you can use a converter for that! Big smile - if you use GNU/Linux, you can use the bash script i shared in the last post at https://www.msx.org/forum/msx-talk/development/trying-to-con...

By nitrofurano

Champion (301)

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27-06-2016, 19:43

(the converter didn’t work there, i really wonder why...)

By santiontanon

Paragon (1737)

santiontanon's picture

27-06-2016, 19:58

@Metalion I was suspecting that to be true (requiring lots and lots of tiles) about the smooth scroll... oh, well...

About the WAV or CAS, definitively! I actually just tried the script that nitrofurano linked and the 32kb version in that thread worked perfectly!

I'll add .cas versions to the release when I get back home tonight Smile

By santiontanon

Paragon (1737)

santiontanon's picture

27-06-2016, 19:59

@nitrofurano, we posted at the same time Smile

And really? I tried the "rom2cas_32kb.sh" one and worked perfectly

By AxelStone

Prophet (3189)

AxelStone's picture

27-06-2016, 20:55

santiontanon wrote:

Yeah, scroll is the part I'm most unhappy about the game. Specially since internally the game does compute all the positions of bullets, ship, ball, etc. at a resolution of 1/16th of a pixel, but then when rendering, I need to translate those to blocks of 8 pixels, which looks blocky and it's sometimes hard to gauge the current speed of the ship. But oh well, once you get used to it, it's not that bad Smile

I like the scroll, is fast, where is the problem?

Metalion wrote:

AFAIK, any smooth scrolling engine on MSX1 is based on multiple tilesets storing each a little pixel variation from the others, and using the hybrid mode of the VDP in order to be able to use only one bank of tiles on the whole screen. Within the limits of the existing RAM and VRAM, of course.

Correct, the only way to implement smoth scroll in MSX1 is using a lot of tilesets variations. This can be used for 1-axis scroll, but in games that has multidirectional scroll is not a chance since you have to reduce the detail level of tiles drastically. Imagine how many displaced tiles you need to cover all posible scroll directions!

Don't think about it more @santiontanon, game has a very nice speed and gameplay.

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